Episode 2: Creating A Roadmap

As the journey to trading places with your aging parents continues, Hilary and Lisa outline what to think about as you start to create your own care roadmap. They cover key considerations like your parents’ health, mobility, professionals involved, financial resources, your caregiving team and how to balance your parents’ need for agency with your needs to keep them safe. They also stress the need to involve your parents in the process and take time to understand how they might envision this stage of their life. 

We'd like to thank our parents for inspiring us to pay it forward. And thank you to Adam Rochelle for creating our musical vibe. Like what you hear, check his music out at prndlmusic.com

Transcript

(Speaker 1) Hey, welcome back. Let's keep talking about Trading Places, our podcast that dives into all the issues that come up when you swap roles with your aging parents. In this episode, we're gonna talk about creating a roadmap for how you'll care for your parents. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. We really didn't know we needed a roadmap until we hit a major pothole.

(Speaker 1) That was a biggie. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. So while we didn't have a set plan in place or hadn't really thought about what a model was, the three of us siblings figured we just put into place whatever our parents needed to keep them safe and happy and comfortable. But when our step brothers came into town for a visit to help sort some of this out, it felt like their priorities around our parents' care were very different from ours. 

(Speaker 1) That was a bit of a surprise. 

(Speaker 2) It was, and it was a conflict we hadn't really planned on. So we knew we needed to put something in place like a care plan as soon as possible. 

(Speaker 1) Hi, Lisa here.

(Speaker 2) And Hillary.

(Speaker 1) We're sisters chatting at our kitchen counter, and we're ready to continue our conversation. Hope you are too. So how do you go about building your own care roadmap? 

(Speaker 2) You have to know where you are first before you can actually create a plan. It's, it's kind of like, you know, starting out with your GPS and you know where you are and you know where you wanna go, and the GPS kinda gives you a sense of how you might get there, but just like following a map and knowing your destination, you could hiit a, a bit of a roadblock. 

(Speaker 1) Yeah, it changes all the time. You get traffic jams, you get, you get all kinds of driving issues and you gotta be prepared for that with, you know, what we're calling a care roadmap. It's really just some guidelines and, it's not set in stone and it will continue, um, to change as you go down the way.

(Speaker 2) And in fact, you can encounter quite a bit of chaos. That's just the nature of the situation. You may be in it now, maybe, um, but there's some things that we thought might be helpful to understand as you figure out where your starting point is. 

(Speaker 1) So first, um, and one of the most important things is to think about is your parents' health. Things like how mobile are they? What's their cognitive health like? I mean, are they slowly declining or rapidly declining? You know, and then consider what health professionals are involved. And also are they, are they ill, are they terminally ill? Are there catastrophic illnesses involved? I mean, we were really lucky to have direct access to their doctors and they agreed, they connected us with them and that kind of helped us stay up to date on their health and what they needed.

And you know, a great example was our stepdad had diabetes, remember? And, and God, the calls to his diabetes doctor were a godsend because his blood sugar was always bouncing all over the place. And we needed that connection. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. But I think also you have to keep in mind, you know, your parents might give you permission to talk to any of their doctors. And you're going on visits with them and you know you're in the room with them and you can ask questions, but, there are some formal ways you would have to get permission in writing, 

(Speaker 1) Right? 

(Speaker 2) So I think you have to think about that.

(Speaker 1) And we'd suggest doing that really from the outset. You know, if you can, if you can get your parents to agree to tell you who they're seeing and give you a list of contact names and numbers and be willing to let you talk to the doctors and you know, as Hillary said, get the documents formalized, um, so that you can have these discussions, that's really gonna put you ahead of the game. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah, I think one thing I also wanna highlight is, you know, you're not always gonna come at this if there's like an acute health issue.

(Speaker 1) Mm-hmm. 

(Speaker 2) You kind of wanna think about this before there's acute illness. 

(Speaker 1) Right.

(Speaker 2) An acute health issue, because if you wait, then you're automatically thrown into a chaotic situation. Right. So, you know, based on some of the tough conversations you've had in, you know, from episode one with your parents, if you kind of have some guideposts of how they might want to be. Even if they're in perfect health, 

(Speaker 1) Right? 

(Speaker 2) Because if they're in perfect health, they're gonna just say they don't need anything. 

(Speaker 1) Well, and things change. Change as we all change. And sometimes they change faster than you would expect them to. So, so health is a big one. Um, so are their finances, I mean, you know, if you wanna know what resources your parents have available for care. 

(Speaker 2) Do they have retirement savings that could help pay for their care, or do they have a long-term care plan? Insurance plan. 

(Speaker 1) I wish I did. 

(Speaker 2) I mean, and I think, um, you know, I think people in their generation may have had, it. They didn't. 

(Speaker 1) No. They planned to just, what is called self-insuring. Right. Which is basically paying for their own care. 

(Speaker 2) Right. 

(Speaker 1) You know, and then people may or may not be able to do that.

(Speaker 2) Right. And, sometimes there might be a life insurance policy. I know people put life insurance policies in place for final expenses and, and burials and all that. Stuff. 

(Speaker 1) It's good to know about those. 'cause a lot of times those get overlooked. 

(Speaker 2) Right? And, sometimes they can be cashed in for current expenses if you need them. 

(Speaker 1) Yep. You know, the other thing to think about financially is will the cost of your parents' care fall on you in any way? And, what can you afford? And we're not just talking about paying for their care. You know, the reality is if you're caring for them, you might have to work less and make less money in order to take care of them. Or maybe you're incurring extra childcare expenses 'cause you're busy with your parents, you know? 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. So it's, uh, yeah, you actually have to think very carefully about those downstream expenses, um, with the model you set up for your parents? 

(Speaker 1) I don't think we gave that as much thought as we should have, so…

(Speaker 2) No, no.

(Speaker 1) Buyer beware. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. Yeah. And it's also important, you know, besides getting, um, sort of access to their doctors and who's involved, you might wanna find out who else might be involved. Mm-hmm. Uh, some people have lawyers they've worked with and…

(Speaker 1) Some people have financial planners or advisors. 

(Speaker 2) Right. And, and um, and you know, we were actually pretty lucky that our parents were allowing us to have some connection with those people, or at least be involved in some early conversations. So we were very clear on what our starting point was and what, you know, they had to contribute and yeah, what level of care. 

(Speaker 1) That helped us make decisions about what we could do. Yeah, I mean, that was really important. Um, you know, and again, not everybody, not all parents are gonna be that transparent, but if you can, if you can get that set up ahead of time, um, that was super helpful for us.

And also we also had access to, I mean, there are certain documents, um, that help plan for this phase of life. We'll go into those in more detail in another episode. But things like. Do you know if they have a will? Um, do they have a healthcare proxy that's a document that basically appoints someone else to make healthcare decisions for them?

(Speaker 2) Yeah. Do they have, um, you know, a durable power of attorneys set up, like if they're incapacitated and can't handle their finances or big decisions? A durable power of attorney is somebody who can do that. Yeah. And, um, that's really important. 

(Speaker 1) Absolutely. And so, and also, you know, you, you might hear about probate, which is, you know, a way that, um, and again, not gonna go into a lot of details on this now, but if they haven't made certain provisions if they have money or they have property and they haven't set it up in an estate plan of any sort, you know, that can get tied up in probate court, kind of figuring out who gets what. And that takes a really long time. And that can be really challenging if you do have to pay for final funeral expenses or whatever. Or taxes. 

(Speaker 2) And, and if they don't have this in place or you know, they might not be able to seek professional assistance with that, a lot of states have free templates Yep. And, um, documents available so that they can get that paperwork set up and, and they might already have done all that. And you actually wanna have all that in a central place.

(Speaker 1) Yep. And you wanna know where those are, you know, we. Um, we didn't, I mean, when it came to, we had a lot of healthcare decisions to make, right? Yes. Yeah. And so we needed to be clear on, you know, their healthcare agents. I mean, with our mom, it was us, but, but with our, our stepdad, you know, even though we were kind of on the ground day to day.taking care of him, our stepbrother, who lived across the country was his healthcare agent.

(Speaker 2) And that was really a difficult situation. Yep. Because I was filling all the pill boxes, you know, on a weekly basis. I was taking him to all his doctor's appointments. Mm-hmm. You were talking with the doctors and so when it did come to making some decisions, that was really, that was hard thing to do.

Yeah. Cause we had more insight and, um, it was kind of like a mismatch. And it's not to say that you can't, one person doesn't have to be in control. I think the documents work that you can have two people working in concert or, you know, in consultation with each other. So that's something to really understand because the people who are involved in the nuances of their daily life really should help make some of those decisions or, or are better equipped to make those decisions. 

(Speaker 1) Well. And so, you know, you gotta think of, again, if there's an opportunity to do that ahead of time. I mean, um, before some of those really tough healthcare decisions need to be made, um, then that is gonna put you one step ahead of the game, you know?

And, um, we talked about how, you know, the documents, knowing where they are. You also think about who has access to them. And this is a toughie. Yeah. I mean, you know, you want everybody in the family to be on the same page. Sometimes that's just challenging. We had a blended family, and we encountered a lot of conflict around the documents and what was in them. We Had some unexpected behavior, um, over our parents' will. So again, if you have an opportunity, this is an eyes wide open moment. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. 

(Speaker 1) Think about where they are and who can see them and, and also who can make changes. 

(Speaker 2) Right. It's just, um, that it was surprising. Yes. Um, to encounter, you know, how someone might utilize different types of information, and in the end, all you really want is for your parents' wishes to be carried out. 

(Speaker 1) Right? 

(Speaker 2) You know, in terms of the end or in terms of how they wanna live their life. Sure. And that's really important to consider. And, you know, that whole experience, I don't know, but you know, you and I have talked about this, but I think it made us both think about what we need to do for our own families.

Yes. Getting our ducks in a row. Yes. And thinking about, you know, making sure the documents are there and, and, and talking, being open with our kids about plans and what's gonna go on and what's going where. And um…

(Speaker 2) Oh, it's so important because, yes, now I, you know, we've gotten a lot of that in place now. Yes. But I have to say, going through this with our parents, you know, we did a will 30 years ago. Yeah. And it listed one child. Yep. And we have three. It makes you think, and you know we learned a lot, I think. 

(Speaker 1) We did. Um, and so in the process of all of this, we also learned a lot about some of the things that can help define your care models, some more things, um, and to be really aware to, you know, don't go into this thinking, you're grabbing the reins and taking control. It's about balance. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. And letting your parents have some independence, but also making sure they're safe. You know, it is kind of like when we were kids. Mm-hmm. 

(Speaker 1)  What'd you do when people, when our parents told us not to do something 

(Speaker 2) You didn't, or what you could do. Right. And you wanted your independence. Yep. And you know, if your parents told you you were having a babysitter…

(Speaker 1) Yeah. 

(Speaker 2) We're like, no way. 

(Speaker 1) Yeah. 

(Speaker 2) So when you’re telling your parents, you know, you want them to have care, you have to approach it in a way that actually gives them agency, you know? 

(Speaker 1) Yep. Yeah. I mean, 'cause they're gonna fight for their independence, you know, even if they're really fragile. But remember, you are trading places. Yeah. So you gotta, you gotta kind of balance what you think is right for your parents' care. Um, with what they want. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. And going back to that conversation we talked about in episode one. Um, just the hard conversation, um, understanding what their wishes are, what do they want and what are they struggling with?

(Speaker 2) Because that could really define their care model. They might think they're having trouble with one thing and you might see them having trouble with five and you gotta, you gotta meet in the middle. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. Yeah. But if you start trying to solve their problems first, um, they're just gonna push back.

(Speaker 1) So, no, you gotta get their trust and you gotta, you gotta have them feel like they have, you know, they have some say in defining the care model. Yeah. 

(Speaker 2) I think one of the biggest surprises for us was balancing what they wanted with what we had the capacity to do. Oh, yeah. And that we didn't think about that at all.

You don't think about that. It smacked us in the head because again, you're trading places and you want to care for your parents the way they cared for you. But it's not, it's not easy to balance all the things that have to get done. 

(Speaker 1) Yeah. And then you gotta be careful about what you sign up for.If you give away, you know, you, you agree to everything, and you, and you go all in, um, and you sign up for more than you can handle like we did, then it's really hard to claw it back. 

(Speaker 2) It is. And itn doesn't mean you don't love them. 

(Speaker 1) Right. 

(Speaker 2) You know, I think we were so worried that if we didn't do exactly what they needed. You know. We weren't honoring them, but…

(Speaker 1) It's okay to tell your parents you're human.

(Speaker 2) Right? 

(Speaker 1) Yeah. I mean, we, that was a huge lesson for us. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah, we did, um, we got a mix of resistance and willingness. Um, and they ultimately did acknowledge, um, that they needed help. And, you know, we even had discussions, remember we talked about downsizing?

(Speaker 1) Yes. 

(Speaker 2) Because. Oh, they just had never thinned out and their home was a lot for them to take care of. And you know, we did. We found a great option. And they pushed back. Yeah, they pushed back and didn't want it. And in hindsight, I think that that would've been a great opportunity for us to say, guys, if this is your decision, understand this is gonna be the impact on us.

(Speaker 1) We, but we didn't think about that. I don't, I don't think we really knew what was gonna go into coordinating care, taking care of their home, you know, um, what we could handle. I mean, and I think what we didn't do that we'd suggest you do is really acknowledge that there could, there could be a difference between what you can handle for care and what they want. So, yeah. So again, eyes wide open. I mean, how many times did we get caught up and say…what was our favorite line? 

(Speaker 2) This is not, this is… 

(Speaker 1) Not sustainable. 

(Speaker 2) Not sustainable. Like every morning driving, 'cause we were both working full time. Driving to work saying, this is not sustainable. 

(Speaker 1) And speaking of driving, oh my gosh, that is something else you really need to think about. You know, when you start thinking about what they can or can't handle, should they be driving? 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. And then we were actually, um, I think we were pretty lucky with our stepdad and that, I don't know what brought it up. But I guess he had to take a driving test. Yeah. He failed it and he actually didn't pass it. Yeah. And then he had to do some additional classes and it, and it still didn't work. Which is in the end sad, but probably a blessing in disguise. 

(Speaker 1) It made drawing that line for him very easy. Right. But I think it made mom…

(Speaker 1) Dig in her heels. Dig, dig in. Even more so because. If she wasn't gonna be driving, then she  felt like, oh my gosh, our independence is gone. But you really have to think about, um, safety because I don't know, do you remember that day mom drove to us? She came over to visit. 

(Speaker 1) Yep. 

(Speaker 2) And then she was backing down our driveway and  I was standing at the top and I saw her just aiming right for the mailbox. Yep. And. My husband was on the street.

He had been coming home and he's honking and she's getting flustered. She doesn't understand what's going on, and she hit the mailbox. 

(Speaker 1) She trashed the mailbox, 

(Speaker 2) Trashed the mailbox, and her car.

(Speaker 1) Thankfully only a mailbox and a car, but not herself. 

(Speaker 2)  Right? Yeah. And not, God forbid, another person. And you think about what could have happened, right? So you just, things can change in a nanosecond. Mm-hmm. And you just. It's a lot of liability and a lot of risk. Yeah. 

(Speaker 1) Yeah, driving's a big one. Yeah. Taking away the keys is hard figuring out when that stops. But, you know, another thing to think about is, you know, in terms of what they can and cannot handle, can they manage their home and the maintenance of their home?

Or do you need someone to step in? Hillary's laughing because we really found out the hard way. Our parents, we thought our parents were handling it. 'Cause our, our mom was really meticulous about that. Um, we, you know, got hit over the head with things like the heat in the house didn't work.

(Speaker 2) And one of, oh, and one of the windows was about to fall out.

(Speaker 1) Because it was rotted. Um, so, you know, you gotta think, are they really paying attention to their home?

(Speaker 2) And, and, um. Who's paying the bills? Who's managing the mail? Who's managing the finances? And oh, you were a godsend because you would go in on a weekly basis and I think it would, at first it just started with you kind of sitting with mom and having dinner, and watching her write checks. And slowly you were able to take, take it over, and she trusted you. Did she let you set up everything electronically? 

(Speaker 1) No. 

(Speaker 2) No. That would've been, that would’ve made it so much easier. That would've been, yes, that would've been great. Um, but. Yeah, it's, but that took a lot.

(Speaker 1) That took a long time. It took a lot of time and it was time consuming.

Well, you know, I think of all the things that we'll say we didn't do right, that was something that I think we did do, right? Because had I gone in and just said, no, we're doing everything electronically. I'm taking it all over. I'm doing it my way. Nope. You know that the time that I spent with her and making copies of all the checks and all the statements and everything else, and kind of doing it her way, it really helped.

So when the time came that she couldn't handle it, and it, and we got to that point, yeah. You know, she was messing up the checkbook and, and she, she couldn't write very well. Um, so when the time came. It was okay for me to take it over. Right. So I think, you know, again, um, piece of advice if, if you can help your parents with their finances early on, while they're still cognitively aware and they, they can be open with you, it's just gonna, it's just gonna allow you that chance to build that trust, right?

(Speaker 2) And then the other thing to think about is when you do get to the point where you are gonna bring in some care to help them. Yeah. Some assistance. Yep. You know, who makes those decisions? You wanna, again, give them some agency, but, but not too much. But, but you can't, um, I mean, I think there were some situations where they decided we had set up a whole plan and then one day they just decided, oh, they didn't need so and so to come. 

(Speaker 1) Yep. 

(Speaker 2) Or, eh, we don't like that person. Or they're not working out, and you just have to be on the same page. Yes. So that you don't get blindsided so that they're not left without help.

(Speaker 1) Or they don't choose the wrong help. 'cause we remember, we did let them hire one and she was a nice person, but was really taking advantage of them.

(Speaker 2) And she convinced them to like, pay for her car. 

(Speaker 1) Oh my God. 

(Speaker 2) Right. 

(Speaker 1) That was just insane. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. 

(Speaker 1) Um, you know, and, and considered like, not just the people that you hire for care, but do they need other support to run their household? I mean. Do you remember the 11 o'clock trips over there? For tech support? Oh, yeah. I mean, you did a lot of those. 

(Speaker 2) I did a lot of that. Yeah. You know, um, the, oh my God, I, or I think I erased all my emails, or my calendar isn't working, or, yeah. And it's, that was mom. It's just really, yeah, and it's a crisis and it's really, you know, it's, it's a lot. But, you know

I didn't mind doing that. You know, again, it’s just another thing, it's just like a totality…Like if you're doing that and you're doing all the other stuff. Yes. Again, it gets back to, um, their capacity. 

(Speaker 1) So well, and that might help you figure out actually how much care they need. I mean, we really struggled with this because, like we said, our parents didn't want people in the house all the time. Um, and we were surprised at how much they needed. How quickly, um, you know, health can decline. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. It um, you know, they're, um, are they like able to stay alone at night? Are they, um, are they comfortable staying alone at night? You know, we had some situations where I think mom had a hospital stay and she fell. She broke her hip and then had to go into rehab. And two things to think about here. First is we didn't wanna leave our stepdad alone. Yep. And he couldn't be left alone. Mm-hmm. And that was really eye-opening to see, you know, he had diabetes.

(Speaker 1) He actually told us he was afraid to be alone at night. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. You know, and that was eye-opening. And, and it was to like understand if his numbers went down low in the middle of the night, or if he needed a snack or, um. You know, there was a lot to manage. But then the second thing is, you know, when you have a parent coming out of rehab, you think they're all healed, everything's gonna go back to normal. 

(Speaker 1) No. 

(Speaker 2) And sometimes they do. You know, sometimes they do. But I think one of the surprising things for us, and, and this was a hard thing to, to, to come to grips with, is they weren't going back to their, their normal selves. No. You know, physically or emotionally. Yeah. 

(Speaker 1) And that was tough on us physically and emotionally. Right. 

(Speaker 2) But you reach a different kind of normal mm-hmm. And they may not go back. And that's a really hard thing for kids to accept of their parents.

(Speaker 1) Well, 'cause your parents are, you know, sort of when you're younger, you think they're omnipotent. Yeah. And you know, they're  the tough ones. And, and also when we're younger, you know, we do heal better. Yeah. And, and as people get older that doesn't always happen. So. Yeah. And mom's rehab visit was that, that was hard. That was, um, and the sleepovers with our step-dad were harder. Yeah. That was, you know, we were trading off every other night and um, that was exhausting. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. But I think one thing you did do before we got into that whole situation is you would put in the medical guardian. The medical guardian. Yeah. And there are lots of different companies that do it, but it's, yeah.

(Speaker 1) Just an emergency alert system. 

(Speaker 2) Right. And 'cause they may not have their cell phone with them. Yep. And they could wear a lanyard or there's a button. Yep. And God forbid somebody falls. And they used it a couple of times. 

(Speaker 1) They did use it. And so that was really helpful. Yeah, I mean that, I think that got us through before we put in overnight care that kind of, that gave us a little bit of peace of mind until we did get to the point where we knew they needed overnight care. But I think, you know, so much of this, whatever you put in, and, and we had to, we had to talk them into the whole medical guardian system and then eventually the overnight care, it was really all about trust. Yeah. And I think, um, I think we did do a good job of this. Just, um, they, our parents were really good about letting us in, but I think we were really good about being transparent with them, always letting them know if we were gonna call one of their people or talk to one of their doctors and why were we making the call and if we, and if it was possible, include them.

So I think that went a long way to keeping all lines of communication open. 

(Speaker 2) Absolutely. And um, you know, it's kind of sad to bring this up, but access to all the personal information, um. It might be abused by some other family members when you least expect it. When you least expect it. So we all seemed to be on the same page. Um, but you know, we were in a blended family. Mm-hmm. And not all of us were on the same page. 

(Speaker 1) No. 

(Speaker 2) Al ot of time all it came down to how the money, how their money was spent on their care and that was hard. Yeah. And, and we'll go through, we're gonna have a whole episode on some of the things to think about when you have, uh, a blended family.

Yep. Um, so that it's a situation where you go into it with your eyes wide open mm-hmm. And maybe anticipate some of the things that you don't expect. Encounter the conflicts, or you can deal with some of this stuff ahead of time. Yep. So that you're all on the same page. Yeah. 

(Speaker 1) I mean, I think there, you know, you still gotta, there, there still may be conflicts.

There just may be, you know, it may be that you're, you know, coming at it from a different perspective, but at least if you sort of know what you could run into. I, think that helps a lot. 

(Speaker 2) Yeah. And this all may sound like a lot of research and a, and a lot of soul searching. It is, and then it really is.But the time and conversations that you, um, can put into this will actually create a foundation. For some of the critical care decisions mm-hmm, that you end up having to make down the road. Yes. And um, yeah, I mean, one of the biggest ones is whether your parents are going to age in place or go to a senior care community.

(Speaker 1) That's huge. 

(Speaker 2) It's really big and, um, you know, it's a lot of stuff involved in that. Mm-hmm. Um, and again, you know, it takes a lot of talk about, uh, wishes and goals and 

(Speaker 1) Capacity. 

(Speaker 2) Capacity and agency. Yep. Um, so we're gonna take a deeper dive into that in our next episode, but just to recap… 

(Speaker 1) Um, so some of the things that we talked about today that will, that should go into your care model, are..You know, taking a close look at your parents' health, um, and where they are and how mobile they are and where they are cognitively. That can determine your care model, their financial situation, kind of resources they have. And, um, it's gonna dictate what they can afford and what they can have, um, for care.

Um, certainly key professionals, you know, there might be lawyers, there might be financial planners. Um. And knowing their healthcare professionals, their doctors, and also all the documents that go along with, you know, sort of planning and supporting them at this time of life. And finally just, you know, really balancing agency, giving them agency with, um, you know, keeping them safe, kind of what they're willing to take on. Balancing what they're willing to take with what, you know, you could give.

(Speaker 2) Right. And it's important to be really honest. Yep. About that. Yep. So, well, my teacup is empty… 

(Speaker 1) And the coffee needs a refill.

(Speaker 2) So it's time for us to sign off. 

(Speaker 1) So catch us for the next episode. Um, which we, in which we ask and answer that really tough question...

(Speaker 2) Should they stay or, or should they go? Bye bye.

(Speaker 1) Before we wrap up here, we just wanted to take a minute to level set about our conversation. Remember, this is just the two of us sharing our journey. Our comments are educational and shouldn't be taken as advice or as a prescription for caregiving. Instead, think of it as a starting point for your own journey as you figure out how to care for your parents.

(Speaker 2) We'd like to thank our own parents for inspiring us to pay it forward. And thank you to Adam Rochelle for creating our musical vibe. If you like what you hear, check out his music@adamrochellemusic.com.